Yo, dudes: Alpha males are a myth, according to actual experts on wolves
Manosphere misogynists like to tell themselves fairy tales about women. Their favorite such tale, repeated endlessly, is one called “The Cock Carousel” – sometimes referred to in expanded form as the “Alpha Asshole Cock Carousel” or the “Bad Boy Cock Carousel.” (Hence that Rooster-riding gal you see in this blog’s header about half the time.)
Despite the different names, the story is always, monotonously, the same: In their late teens and twenties, when they’re at the height of their sexual appeal, women (or at least the overwhelming majority of them) have sex in rapid succession with an assortment of charismatic but unreliable alpha males and “bad boys” who make their vaginas (or just ‘ginas) tingle. Then, sometime in their mid-to-late twenties, these women “hit the wall,” with their so-called sexual market value (or SMV) dropping faster than Facebook’s stock price. As Roissy/Heartiste puts it, in his typically overheated prose:
So sad, so tragic, the inevitable slide into sexual worthlessness that accompanies women, the withering tick tock of the cosmic clock stripping their beauty in flayed bits of soulletting mignons like psychological ling chi. A sadistic thief in the night etching, billowing, draping and sagging a new affront to her most preciously guarded asset.
While many women try to pretend they’ve still “got it,” even at the ripe old age of thirty, they inevitably have to either get off or get thrown off the “cock carousel.” At this point the more savvy women glom onto some convenient “beta male” who, while somewhat lacking in sexual appeal, will at least be a good husband and provider for them – and in many cases the children they’ve had with alpha male seed. Those women who don’t accept the new reality are destined to end up alone and childless, surrounded by cats.
To borrow the phrase South Park used in its episodes about Scientology and Mormonism, this is what manosphere men actually believe. Not only that, but they claim that this fairy tale is based on real science.
So who are these mysterious alpha males that get the women so excited? As one guide to pickup artist (PUA) lingo puts it:
In animal hierarchies, the Alpha Male is the most dominant, and typically the physically strongest member of the group. For example, in wolf packs, the “alpha wolf” is the strongest member of the pack, and is the leader of the group. This position of leadership is often achieved by killing or defeating the previous Alpha Male in combat. Alpha wolves have first access to food as well as mating privileges with the females of the pack.
Social status among human social groups is less rigidly defined than in the animal kingdom, but there are some recognizable parallels. Although people don’t often engage in physical violence to achieve dominance, there are still recognizable leaders in different fields who have wide access to material resources and women.
Because the qualities of the Alpha Male (such as social dominance and leadership) are attractive to women, many PUAs have adopted these ideals as models of emulation. In fact, the term “alpha” has come be shorthand for the qualities of an attractive man, and it is a common refrain among PUAs to be “more alpha” or to “out alpha” competitors.
There’s a certain logic to all this. But unfortunately for the PUAs and other manospherians the notion of the Alpha male is based on bad science. The notion of Alpha dominance, as the definition above notes, came originally from studies of wolf packs. Even if we assume that wolf behavior is somehow a good model upon which to base our understanding of human romance – as manosphere men and evolutionary psychologists tend to do – the science behind the Alpha male wolf has now come completely undone, with many of those who promulgated the theory in the first place decades ago now explicitly repudiating it.
The problem, you see, is that the studies underlying the notion of the alpha male wolf, who aggressively asserts his dominance over beta males in order to rule the pack, were all based on observations of wolves in captivity. In the real world, wolf packs don’t work that way at all. Most wolf packs are basically wolf families, with a breeding pair and their pups. When male pups reach adulthood, they don’t fight their fathers for dominance — they go out and start their own families.
As noted wolf behavior expert L. David Mech, one of those who helped to establish and popularize the notion of the alpha wolf in the first place, explains on his website:
The concept of the alpha wolf is well ingrained in the popular wolf literature at least partly because of my book “The Wolf: Ecology and Behavior of an Endangered Species,” written in 1968, published in 1970, republished in paperback in 1981, and currently still in print, despite my numerous pleas to the publisher to stop publishing it. Although most of the book’s info is still accurate, much is outdated. We have learned more about wolves in the last 40 years then in all of previous history.
One of the outdated pieces of information is the concept of the alpha wolf. “Alpha” implies competing with others and becoming top dog by winning a contest or battle. However, most wolves who lead packs achieved their position simply by mating and producing pups, which then became their pack. In other words they are merely breeders, or parents, and that’s all we call them today, the “breeding male,” “breeding female,” or “male parent,” “female parent,” or the “adult male” or “adult female.” In the rare packs that include more than one breeding animal, the “dominant breeder” can be called that, and any breeding daughter can be called a “subordinate breeder.”
So the dominant male wolves – those whom manosphere dudes would still call the alphas – achieve this position not by being sexy badasses but simply by siring and taking responsibility for pups. To use the terminology in the manner of manosphere dudes, alphas become alphas by acting like betas. That’s right: alphas are betas. (For more of the details, see this paper by Mech; it’s in pdf form.)
Also, they’re wolves and not humans, but that’s a whole other kettle of anthropomorphized fish.
Posted on August 22, 2012, in alpha asshole cock carousel, alpha males, bad boys, beta males, evo psych fairy tales, heartiste, MGTOW, misogyny, PUA, worst writing in the history of the universe and tagged alpha asshole cock carousel, alpha males, bad boys, beta males, evolutionary psychology, heartiste, mgtow, misogyny, pickup artists, PUA, wolves. Bookmark the permalink. 466 Comments.
Jif used to be an oven cleaner in the UK. Now it’s called Cif. Using this knowledge I shall attempt to translate the whole paragraph:
And this one here, this women having sex meme is one that men who don’t hate women ad women had better defeat or the female imperative of women being able to find men that don’t hate them who jump in with both feet merely because the woman helps him to clean the oven might just get called out for the truest scam that there is.
*squints* Nope, still doesn’t make sense.
Although BoyFantastic and I tried to fix our oven today, we took the door off and had it out of the unit and everything. Our hands got covered in oven gunk, so we decided that it will get a Proper Clean once it is fixed.
Does this mean we have to get married now? And does this make him a beta or an alpha? I’M SO CONFUSED.
Also I do not want BoyFantastic to dive with both feet into my vagina once our oven is clean because that sounds really painful and vaginas do not work that way.
Back! Back to your grave, O foul zombie thread! Behold the cleansing power of Pelor the Shining!
*turns undead*
Before this thread goes back to its well-deserved rest, I have to say that “Schroedinger’s vagina” is the best thing I’ve heard this week.
Sure are a lot of trolls willing to pair their creepy-ass faces with their creepy-ass opinions today.
I remember once seeing an incredibly gross and disturbing commercial where a woman applied peanut butter like perfume, and dudes were chasing her. Maybe that’s what the Jif reference was?
thenatfantastic: If women are having sex with you because they want to… it’s not “good sex”. Good sex has to have the whiff of the chase, a sense that she was overwhelmed by your studly prowess, or swept away by the manliness of your swagger.
The other way… they want sex, and they want it with you…. BORING!!!! Doesn’t matter enthusiastic she is, it doesn’t matter what amazing little things she knows how to do; to make you forget your own name, and pass out from the pleasure… that just shows she’s been “bangin’ the Bad Boys” and wasting all the good stuff on them, not saving it for you.
Which is why the “manginas” need to stop women from learning how to do that.
I use bacon myself. Works like a charm.
Nothing says “man who is contented with his rich and fulfilling life” like thread necromancy and TL;DR comments full of rage-spittle.
This calls for a rationalization hamster. That bit about gravity was too good not to. http://www.quickmeme.com/meme/3rem9w/
This author is a moron
Long live heartiste!
Women are the ones who drive the drivel that comes out of these guys’s minds.
The reality is much nore simple. Women mostly only care about money an looks.
Your comeback will be something attacking men. It does not matter if 100% of men are assholes and the Devil makes women behave the way that women generally do and nothing is a woman’s fault. Facts are facts.
Joe, What are the facts that are facts? Any proof that doesn’t involve your ass? Thanks in advance.
What is it with MRM morons and the zombie thread thing? Have the zombies eaten their brains, or what?
What kind of sad bastard spends Christmas Eve trolling sites full of people he hates?
(Hope everyone else is having a lovely day! I’m going to go eat lots of tasty things soon.)
CassandraSays, that’s exactly what I think! I actually noticed that last year, new trolls coming to Manboobz and resurrecting old threads to make horrible hateful comments. I remember thinking, “How sad and pathetic.” Everyone else, especially the regulars, is usually just taking a quiet moment to wish everyone well and relate how their day is going, but these guys are just spewing bile on a day that is supposed to be peaceful and relaxing. Says a lot about the personal lives of MRAs, I reckon…
I’m not a regular (wish I was but don’t have the time) and haven’t commented in a while, mainly due to changing jobs and being pretty busy with that (interestingly my new job is with a homelessness charity which overwhelmingly helps men – how about that?), but I lurk a lot and I just want to wish everyone a lovely holiday! I’ve had a lovely dinner at my sister-in-laws. followed by a nightcap at my mother-in-laws and now I’m sitting in front of In Bruges with a huge platter of cheese, a bottle of red wine, Mr Ponkz and my cat. Fabz!
Happy holidays, Ponkz!
Merry Christmas, Ponkz!
Happy Happy Merry Merry to all!
Have had a lovely holiday dinner (eaten early so we could go to THE HOBBIT, but then it OMG started SNOWING, and we chickened out because Texas drivers on snow and ice are soooooooooo scary, scarier than trolls even).
And find the zombie thread trolls to be hilarious.
“What is it with MRM morons and the zombie thread thing? Have the zombies eaten their brains, or what?” — Quite possibly? My theory is that the necromancy that created the troll extends onto the threads, causing stupid comments by like, the laws of attraction or something.
Happy Holidays // Merry Christmas guys!
“Women are the ones who drive the drivel that comes out of these guys’s minds.
The reality is much nore simple. Women mostly only care about money an looks.”
Proof, once again that we think better of men then trolls do. Hey joeblow, what are you? A mindless droid who can’t control his own thoughts? If you’re thinking “drivel,” isn’t it your responsibility to correct yourself? Women only think of money and looks? *Sigh* Another troll who thinks that not being hip-deep in ass makes him some kind of martyr. If you think women are so shitty, it stands to reason they won’t be flocking to you…get it? And I’m positive you’re only interested in a woman’s mind, right? Right?
I read back through this thread since it was resurrected (I don’t think I’d started reading when it was posted). I’m spending time with my family since it’s holidays and all and the combination got me thinking. Do these guys think ‘alphas’ never get married? They just have lots of sex forever, ignoring any children they happen to spawn? That only betas ever commit to a woman and raise children?
Because my brother would be an alpha, by whatever metric these guys happen to choose. He was one of those cliche popular, sporty guys in high school, and now has a well paid job, in traditionally masculine field, where he is in charge. He could probably be dating girls half his age if he wanted to be. But instead he has a wife and 3 kids who he loves and supports. His wife is also an intelligent, independent woman who was *gasp* around 30 (and not a virgin *double gasp*) when they got married.
I am sure my brother isn’t unique in this, since it’s a pretty traditional life trajectory. How do these PUA arseholes reconcile men like my brother with the fantasy world they live in? I am also certain he’d have no time for heartiste and his fellow try-hards.
Also, there is no alpha male dominating the females in lion prides:
“Alpha females form the nucleus of lion society and lead the pride, dominating the males and the beta and sub adult females”
http://wildliferanching.com/content/lion-panthera-leo
joeblow, you sound awfully mad. you must be one of those people that flies into butthurt defense mode when he sees people exposing the misogyny he’s obsessed with.
Andywatt – the whole alpha/beta thing comes from bad studies of wolves in captivity, whose behaviour doesn’t reflect their wild behaviour anyway. The terms to use should simply be parent and child. The so-called betas in wolf packs are the offspring of the breeding pair – of course they’re not going to be breeding within their family unit, they go off to start new packs. But try telling that to MRAs.
Not a MYTH!
this guide is actually insane
http://www.alpha-male.org/
literally explains exactly how to be an alpha male
And it’s on the internet so it must be true! /sarcasm
PS “literally” – doesn’t mean what you think it means
Not to mention, wolves are also much more monogamous than humans. If these men actually started behaving like wolves they’d probably have better manners.
So, in the face of SCIENCE… you present more PUA garbage.
You LITERALLY cannot get past your cognitive dissonance.
I FIGURATIVELY rolled my eyes so high they left my skull.
Insane also doesn’t mean what he thinks it means. But I’m cranky, my morning crazy pills tasted particularly awful today.
Actually, that entire comment is one big Inigo Montoya moment
@Kim: “I am also certain he’d have no time for heartiste and his fellow try-hards.” I can’t imagine any man who isn’t completely inept at being a decent human and knows the first thing about social interactions with women would have time for heartiste.
I’ll just leave this here… http://www.snorgtees.com/misuse-of-literally-makes-me-figuratively-insane
=)
`Then, sometime in their mid-to-late twenties, these women “hit the wall,”“
Actually, most hit The Wall around 30-35
BRRRAAAAAIIIINNNNNSSSSSS
You necro’ed a thread to say that?
Reblogged this on woosterlang87.
Cassandra, real men hate betas and feminists because of the emasculation of our society. We don’t want our sons and daughters to be brainwashed into mindless freaks by you lot.
Me, I just feel pity for you. What a wonderful life y’all, especially males, could have if you stopped listening to feminist horseshit propaganda.
Pablo, betas make up 99% of society. I’m one, you are too most probably.
It’s not propaganda – horseshit is brilliant stuff. As a feminist, I recommend it for growing fantastic courgettes (zuccini if you live across the pond) and can confirm that my roses just love it. Only last week, a real man delivered a load of the stuff to our allotments, to my joy. I anticipate a wonderful season of flowers and veggies.
….right, we hate betas! Because…
Because the word beta means something!
Which was debunked in the OP.
Dude.
I refer you to my earlier comment in this stream. I will now reinterpret your comment through the lens of the actual terms as understood by actual scientists.
You hate teenaged boys? You suck.
ManOnTheMoon:
Read the OP before commenting.
Pablo, let me tell you about heroes.
There was an age of heroes, once – a time of great myths and greater deeds. Heroic, valiant figures strove forward and led, by example, the tribes of men towards a brighter future. In recognition for their deeds, they were given titles, land, honour, reputations as noble men, and all were well. Idolized, they served as examples for those who came after – weaker men, perhaps, but men who could look to the glory of these stoic heroes and learn the truths of the world.
This, our age, is not the age of heroes. Great Men are no longer an indistinguishable part of nature, because the entire notion, the thought of those figures leading the humble masses, the alphas in their quests was… debunked. The Great Man theory was hogwash, in the end. And in that crash, the pillars of legendary achievements by noble spirits striving against the odds fell to the way side. This is not the age of myth, this is the age of statistics and popular movements, of groundswell and demographics.
And let me tell you something – it’s a better age. It’s a nicer age. It’s a time not of myths and legends and heroes, but of social security, vaccines and safety guidelines.
Your feeble theorizing about “Alpha” and “Beta” and “Gamma” is a lacklustre remnant of the notion that Persons Matter, Over Time – and the thing is, sad as it might be, they do not. People achieve things by dint of their numbers and the realities of the time. Auteurs, while an interesting concept, is so much bullshit. Visionary genius is a marketing term these days, not a descriptor of things worth emulating. Some people give great insights into things, and those people we honour – sure – but those people build on others who build on others who build on others.
“Flashes of insight” and “One of a kind” are terms used to describe washing machines now, not people.
This isn’t the age of heroes, this is the age of shoulders, giants, and standing there on.
There are no Great Big Alpha Men who rule the land, commanding pussy and skulking about in the dark, stealing the chasity from innocent virgins with a sly grin and a witty remark.
When you talk about Alphas, you talk about things you’d like to be – you talk about the “If only, then I”. The reason you don’t have a harem, the reason people don’t flock to you in the street and throw themselves at you is not because you’re a beta, or because other people are more alpha than you. It’s because you are not, currently, the kind of person people would throw themselves at.
Your masturbatory navel gazing implies that if you only could become “alpha” enough you could “Buckle the trend” and start getting the “Pussy” you “deserve”.
The only thing stopping you is the notion that you could, if only some circumstance change…
If you want to learn to talk to people and be a better person, start now, don’t deviate, and don’t excuse your inability to connect and the vagaries of your life on some noble theory of how you’re just not alpha enough and how us feminists demean you.
Here’s a tip. The 99 % of society who are “betas” are also the 99 % of society that matters. That get things done. That keep the world running. They are not hapless dupes in some system designed to suck them dry while alphas run rampant through pantied fields.
Get over it. Please.
Fibinachi, I felt as if I had fully addressed his post by simply mocking the way he twisted reality to get to his conclusion.
You have stripped away his words to get to the priors and assumptions that led him to twist reality.
I make genuflection in your general direction. (I assume somewhat south and west. If you go far enough south and west for long enough at the proper angle you will traverse the entirety of the planet, having circumnavigated it a near-infinite number of times).
Ooooh, circumnavigational genuflection. You, Howard Bannister, are a scholar and a swell person.
And with your added genuflection and my platinium, diamond covered internet I shall soon ascend from this earthly plane and fly high into the bloggosphere, on a trail of internets and accolades. Ha ha, ha ha ha! Ha ha, ha ha ha!
Mobius strips are fantastic. Spheres are great. Manboobz is a lovely blog.
I’m not necroing this thread. I’m… erm… making dialogue.
There is no alpha/beta binary. In sociology, if we refer to people in terms of alpha/beta, we also attach gamma, at the very least, and also delta and epsilon. In the animal kingdom, we have gamma, delta, epsilon, and omega. To insist that there were two categories to begin with is trite; even following the rules set by the animal kingdom, now debunked, there are several ranks of animals; alpha does not get choice of female, by this rule, alpha commits to a pairing and sticks to it, for the most part, but gets priority in nourishment.
If we’re applying this ruling to humans, which we certainly shouldn’t, most *people* are not alpha, or beta, or gamma, or delta, but a mix of all characteristics. Sociologically speaking, an alpha is basically a nomad. Betas are caregivers. By setting up a binary, people insist that this initially *questionable* interpretation of social order implies a lesser characteristic in the role of a beta. In reality, alphas form societies, and betas live in them, according to the model; now, the definitions these Internet communities have given to “alpha males” are contradictory, often solely fitting their own agenda. Some say an alpha male never points fingers at himself, never alters himself, others say an *alpha male* always shoulders accountability; some say an alpha male knows how to follow an agenda in order to be successful, and others claim that an alpha male is not a *corporate tool*.
The Internet model has absolutely no basis in the original theory to begin with; there is no agreement on any of the qualifications of an “alpha male”. I’m sorry if your wife/girlfriend cheated on you, but it wasn’t because you “weren’t man enough”. It’s because she was a woman who was capable of cheating, and you need to be comfortable enough with yourself to accept that it was something you had no control over. You can’t *make* a woman your wife.
(I’m talking to a ghost… the stereotypical “nice guy” who cites this nonsense then becomes a *pussy magnet*, compromising his own identity in the process for the purpose of an ill-founded notion.)
never heard about “sexual market value” and “the wall” b4 the internet
:-s
http://makeshiftalpha.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/sexualvaluewileecoyote.jpg
EGAD!