America: Land of Soulless Hamster Wusses
Street harassment: The engine of civilization
Here’s a little screed, originally from happierabroad.com, that’s been making the rounds of the manosphere lately. The author, anonymous, describes himself as “an Arab, who has lived and travelled all over the world and is a keen observer of society and people.” The aim of his writing? To let those of us in the West know just how disappointed he is with all of us. Especially the wussies and bitches.
Meeting Westerners, one of the things I noticed was how insecure and de-masculinized they seemed to me; compared to myself and the male-dominated, testosterone-driven culture of my land.
Using my own keen sense of observation, I have noticed just an eensy weensy bit of misogyny in his writings. You may notice it as well.
On the internet, most Americans seemed to act like little bitches, little girls brought up in a Feminist perversion of nature.
Well, I don’t know about that whole “perversion of nature” thing, but I have to say the first half of that sentence is pretty spot-on.
It was only after coming to the U.S. and studying here that all the pieces came together - a fascinating look at a dysfunctional man-hating civilization that is the polar opposite of my own culture, and will eventually lead to the collapse of Western civilization.
Uh oh.
Where I come from, men walk proud and rule the streets and testosterone runs in the air; and strong patriarchal foundations of family and the father as ruler of the household. Men harass and aggressively follow women - it is unapologetically a man’s world.
That’s what makes a civilization great: the harassment of women.
Just remember this, men, when you lean out of your car window to yell “Nice ass………WHORE!!!!!!!!!” at passing joggers of the female persuasion, you’re doing your bit to uphold our most noble traditions and help to fend off the forces of darkness.
In the U.S., Feminism has so corrupted the society to it’s core, damaged the very concept of family and the family unit and the father’s role, that society as a whole is like some bizarre alien planet - where men are bland, lack personality, are anti-social, gossipy, soul-less. Men are weak and insecure deep inside … women have all the power and American men seem clueless as to how bizarre the male-female dynamic has become.
In the workplace, Americans are Automatons, like soul-less hamsters on a wheel. Fake conversations, no intellectualism, no interest in other countries, peoples, or history.
Do soul-less hamsters act differently than soulful ones? How can you tell the difference? Do the ones without souls poop more?
Also, terrible social and people skills - at least in California. Most people communicate via twitter and Facebook, even though most of the people on their Facebook live in the same city and a phone call away.
Really? You’re complaining about Facebook? Sorry, that’s just lazy and trite. You’re like the Dane Cook of reactionary misogynist cultural critics.
People are vacuous, shallow, superficial, suggestible. Men raised here are fake, insecure, lack personality, they seem to have “issues.” Women are confused and messed up ..
Wait, what’s that? Is that the dreaded MRA two-period punctuation mark? NOT AGAIN!
Oops. He’s still talking:
You let your women take control, and your society will unravel- it will make your men weak, and destroy your society to it’s core. The patriarchy is a male conceived and enforced institution that was imposed on females, because men, and only men understand well the long-term impacts of civilization and harnessing male energies into productive family units and a stable society …. civilization itself is a result of patriarchy.
You know, if you’re really into harnessing your male energies, you can buy the necessary equipment right here!
To sum if up, it seems to be that the whole country is phitzoprhenic [sic], like a Jekyll and Hyde monstrosity. There is no community, no camaredie, no soul, men and women are willing servants to their corporate masters and slaves to materialism and superficiality; and incredibly conformist, reserved, and politically correct to the point of totalitinarism.
“Conformist?” So now he’s turned into a high school goth?
Come on, dude, if you want to be a social critic, you’re going to need to work a little harder than that. Take a tip or two from this, er, duck:
Posted on August 1, 2011, in alpha males, antifeminism, evil women, manginas, masculinity, men who should not ever be with women ever, MGTOW, misogyny, MRA, reactionary bullshit, sexual harassment, western women suck. Bookmark the permalink. 273 Comments.
Okay, so obv it’s b/c this feminism thing takes time to destroy civs xD so how long is it going to take before feminism destroys all the civilizations?
We’ll check in w/ you after that time period xD
@Katz unless you’re Nancy Drew in which case, uppercutting a bear is feminine AND awesome xD
Ion seems much angrier today than yesterday xD And back to his “I’m cooler than you nerds, NEEERRRRDDS” way xD (while not heeding Obi-wan’s advice xD )”
When you boil it all down, that’s pretty much all he’s got: name-calling and the desperate hope that we’re as miserable as he wants us to be. Just like a real-world bully, but a lot more pathetic.
I know trolls are twice as dumb as shit, but let’s try this anyway.
Well, it’s good to see you’re taking it well in any case. I will give you one thing, it’s amazing how much people reveal about themselves when you give them a little push and let them ramble on.
Skyal, it is a proven fact that none of us leftyish feminist type people own any kind of weapons at all. We’re all happy little hippie pacifists who hate guns and knives and swords and all that shit.
*nonchalantly pushes ammo boxes out of frame with his foot*
Weren’t you the one who kept calling me “internet tough guy” a while back? Oh, irony. Congrats on all the guns you own… I’m sure they’re just a hobby and in no way an expression of repressed anger and/or compensating for something…
I will, however, admit one thing. Watching you blundering around, ineffectually trying to score hits on me and everyone else here is most entertaining, please continue.
Watching you (and Ami, now that I think about it) write post after post about how I’m not affecting you at all is most entertaining, please continue.
ThingsAreBad, I’d also like to read your summary of exactly how feminism is going to destroy civilisation.
I know this wasn’t addressed at me, but wasn’t feminism a big part of communism, with all the leftist Marxist ideology? Equality and all that? Those countries didn’t do too well…
Aside from that, hm… dissolution of the nuclear family and family values, women shamed for wanting to be homemakers/raise a family and told they MUST have a career (which apparently leads to increased stress and decreased happiness, go figure), dissolution of traditional gender roles leading to confused, angry people, political correctness telling us that any lifestyle is permissible and we’re wrong to criticize anybody… those are the things coming to mind for now.
Even if “somebody’s gotta be the homemaker” was a thing beyond question (and it’s really not), why’s it gotta be the woman?
Anyway, this whole idea of a nuclear family where Pa works and Ma tends children and house is largely a myth, or at least restricted to a small proportion of the population. My grandma worked and my great-grandma worked; they just had to raise kids also. (Often by getting babysitting from their grandmothers/aunts/friends; so much for the “nuclear family.”) Grandpa and great-grandpa weren’t rich enough to support the whole family themselves. If you have a problem with women working outside the home, blame the Industrial Revolution.
Feminism didn’t invent the idea of women working; it invented the idea of women being equally valued for their work.
“Feminism didn’t invent the idea of women working; it invented the idea of women being equally valued for their work.”
That is brilliant, Holly.
They kicked Nazi Germany’s ass.
Only because they had sheer numbers on their sides… and if feminists had had their way, with the contraception and the abortions and “non-traditional lifestyles” there would have probably been fewer people to fight for Mother Russia.
HTML fail…
They kicked Nazi Germany’s ass.
Skyal, congrats to you too!
My husband also has a pair of (non-sharpened) swords. I think his grandfather bought them in…Turkey? Syria? I can’t remember. They’re beautiful objects.
Don’t you ever get tired of being wrong?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Russia
Ion, abortion was legal in the Soviet Union from the Revolution until Stalin banned it in 1936: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_in_the_Soviet_Union
So unless the Nazis were beaten by a bunch of preschoolers with pitchforks, your argument doesn’t hold water.
Don’t you ever get tired of being wrong?
So… a Wikipedia page on Russia’s demographics (which I’m not even sure what is supposed to prove) and an article written by an unknown person which sounds like a highschooler’s book report are your rebuttal and reason to call me wrong? Wow, I guess you showed me.
Holly: I won’t dismiss your account about your grandmother working, etc. I do think it’s funny, though, that when one of the Happy Gang here gives a personal account of something, everyone immediately agrees and points to it as proof incontrovertible of The Way Things Really Are(tm) or at the very least doesn’t comment on it. Whereas when someone who opposes you does the same thing, he or she can immediately count on roughly a dozen replies in the vein of “ooh, I guess because it happened to you, it must be universal, huh? Wow, look, X gave a personal anecdote, I guess we have to believe him now, right guys? *knowing smirks all around*”…
Ion, abortion was legal in the Soviet Union from the Revolution until Stalin banned it in 1936: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_in_the_Soviet_Union
So unless the Nazis were beaten by a bunch of preschoolers with pitchforks, your argument doesn’t hold water.
Well, what do you know. Alright, Wikipedia warrior, I’ll give you that one.
I think we’re nowhere near the point of disastrously running out of people, anyway.
I love how we simultaneously don’t want to shame anyone for their lifestyles and shame women for being homemakers. LOGIC!
Ozy - I also still don’t get how “society needs homemakers” leads inevitably to “so women should do it.” It’s not like men can’t change diapers.
@cynickal
“They kicked Nazi Germany’s ass.”
I’d like to say it’s rare to read such a horrific left propaganda piece but it’s pretty standard these days. First off, Germany had literally won WW I before american involvement. The reasons for Germany attacking for WW I were completely disreguarded. Germany offered status quo antebellum after having been so completely dominant. The traitor Woodrow Wilson after swearing to keep the US neutral attacked after the sinking of the Lusitania. Any fool can see sending a pleasure cruise ship into a war zone was a planned sacrifice in order to get the US involved.
Germany was being systematically economically destroyed by the war reparations forced upon them plus sanctions on production and what can only be considered an embargo on German goods. Germany was literally relegated to indentured servitude by the Treaty of Versailles. There are pictures of people burning money to heat their homes because it was cheaper to burn money rather than wood.
Entrance into both world wars by the US were initiated by leftists. Woodrow Wilson and FDR. The leftist who wrote this pathetic excuse for an article claims FDR to be, “the greatest president in United States history.” FDR was a communist thru and thru; Fireside communism with FDR. Every policy he enacted was straight out of the Soviet handbook.
This leftist moron claims, “Hitler used security arguments to take away the German peoples rights.” Well stop off at an airport lefties and see your security forces. Everyone one of you fools cry out for more Government, more security, more laws. Please take my freedom Big Daddy, I’m a braindead leftist.
This braindead, non-thinking leftist turd goes on to yammer about global warming due to carbon emmisions as if it’s a fact. By taking core samples from ice, temperature and carbon content is determined and there is absolutely no correlation between the two. In fact high carbon content correlates to slightly lower temperatures. Most of the scientists who were on the investifation commitee refute any correlation yet their names are listed as participating while failing to note they emphatically disagree.
What is it about leftists being afraid of/discounting any and all of facts?
But then they may not have the masculinity to go out and hunt mammoths or something.
Not only do you not actually look at the citations provided on the wiki page for original sourceing, but the wiki summary also proves you wrong. Which sounds like most high schoolers’ rebuttals are more solidly grounded in reality than you are.
Not only do you not actually look at the citations provided on the wiki page for original sourceing, but the wiki summary also proves you wrong.
Er, what? I genuinely have no idea what you mean or what you’re trying to prove.
And yes, the second article sounds like it was written by a 13-year old for a school assignment. Honestly, at this point it sounds like you just keep replying for the sake of having the last word. Let it go already.
I love how we simultaneously don’t want to shame anyone for their lifestyles and shame women for being homemakers. LOGIC!
Are you saying feminists don’t shame women for wanting to be homemakers? Because I’ve actually got citations. The word “breeder” springs to mind.
By the way Ozy, how do traditionally masculine men and feminine women fit into your all-inclusive, tolerant society? Or are they not progressive enough to have a place in it?
There certainly were women who complained about it in the feminist movement Ion-because they were tired of being told that is all they could ever aspire to.
You never pay attention to that part of the problem do you?
Femmephobia in the feminist movement is a problem, Ion. Your point?
Masculine men and feminine women are perfectly free to be masculine men and feminine women. I don’t think you’re understanding my point, sir. People should be free to do whatever they want, from MMA to knitting, without social opprobrium, as long as it does not harm themselves or others.
“I know this wasn’t addressed at me, but wasn’t feminism a big part of communism, with all the leftist Marxist ideology? Equality and all that? Those countries didn’t do too well…”
Communism gave women comparable opportunities at education, professional involvement, and seeking redress against abuse in court, in countries where it used to be common for husbands to beat their wives to death with little, if any, threat of retribution. Power sharing? Not so much, the overwhelming majority of government officials were still men. As for whether or not those countries did well? Let’s take Russia. Back in the blessed days when women occupied the same status as living room furniture, it was an agrarian, mostly feudal country with a mind-mindbogglingly high level of illiteracy, poor public health and abject poverty. Under communism, it became a highly industrialized superpower, with an educated population capable of making their country a major player in world politics. And though the regime ultimately didn’t do too well, Russia is still a very important and technologically developed country today. I don’t like communist regimes and am always ready to recognize their flaws and shortcomings — but I scoff at people approaching this issue in a quasi-religious, ideological manner. Treating women like cattle doesn’t do society any good; and please keep in mind, “society” isn’t just composed of men. Women are half of society, and being treated like cattle isn’t good for women, so right there, you have half of society whose situation in a patriarchal system is downright abysmal. And it’s not good for the other half of society, either — because oppressing women under-utilizes individuals’ potential.
“Aside from that, hm… dissolution of the nuclear family and family values, women shamed for wanting to be homemakers/raise a family and told they MUST have a career (which apparently leads to increased stress and decreased happiness, go figure), dissolution of traditional gender roles leading to confused, angry people, political correctness telling us that any lifestyle is permissible and we’re wrong to criticize anybody… those are the things coming to mind for now.”
Wow, so much to unpack here. First of all, women in a patriarchal society are shamed for being homemakers and raising a family; it’s part of generally shaming them for being women. Traditionalist men routinely say that their homemaking wives “don’t work”. Devaluing women’s labor is a cherished part of the patriarchal tradition. I’ll grant you that there is a proportion of feminists who also shame women for being homemakers — but the crucial difference here is that women now have a choice. For a traditionalist, however, a woman MUST be a homemaker, and she must be shamed for it, too.
Second, anti-feminists say this all the time, but there is absolutely no evidence that having a career leads to increased stress and “decreased happiness”. All the “studies” I’ve heard of that supposedly prove this contention come out of heavily biased institutions that have a political agenda. There are numerous problems with this. Preliminarily, the goal of feminism isn’t to increase women’s personal happiness, but to provide women with personal autonomy, agency and choices, as well as to make the harassment and assault of women by men less socially acceptable. Moreover, the “studies” I mentioned do not define “happiness”, and make no adjustment for the fact that women who are utterly dependent on their husbands are under a tremendous amount of pressure to characterize themselves as “happy”, even in an anonymous study. (I’ve known a self-described happy homemaker; she shoveled so much Valium in her mouth, her prescription had to be refilled every couple of days. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it’s an anecdote; still, it surprised me how stereotypical this was of a housewife’s “happiness”) Women who lack agency within the family usually come to believe they lack agency generally and are likely to be afraid that the people who perform this “study” will put their husbands on notice if they express any dissatisfaction with their lives.
Third — political correctness, srsly? You mean, in patriarchal societies, there is more than one lifestyle that’s permissible and it’s considered wrong to criticize people who don’t conform? Yeah, I guess that’s why women who have the temerity to venture outside the home in that utopia get harassed so much
@Amused
“in countries where it used to be common for husbands to beat their wives to death with little, if any, threat of retribution.”
Your name says it all, I am indeed amused. Heres a common conversation where husbands commonly beat their wives to death. “Hey Bill wheres your wife?” “Oh, I beat her to death Sam.” “Yea me too, wierd but I’ve noticed a distinct shortage of women.”
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“Treating women like cattle doesn’t do society any good; and please keep in mind, “society” isn’t just composed of men.”
Men would never beat their livestock to death, thats cruel and unusual punishment. Cattle had a purpose.
———————————-
“Devaluing women’s labor is a cherished part of the patriarchal tradition.”
So true, so true. Aren’t you just sick of how on this site as well as the MSM men are praised for all their accomplishments while women are constantly devalued. Damn it Dave and the rest of you commentors, would it kill ya to show women a little appreciation once in a while?
————————————
“Women who lack agency within the family usually come to believe they lack agency generally and are likely to be afraid that the people who perform this “study” will put their husbands on notice if they express any dissatisfaction with their lives.”
Horrible, horrible. Women lacking agency in the home, socially, in education and the workplace. Those damned patriarchal agency thieves. What we need is more womens agencies to give women agency.
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“Yeah, I guess that’s why women who have the temerity to venture outside the home in that utopia get harassed so much”
Temerity is just one more agency in women the patriarchy usurps and ruthlessly crushes. How long will the State continue to show favoritism to men while hobbling women at every opportunity? OH why, oh why must women be eternal victims?
“By the way Ozy, how do traditionally masculine men and feminine women fit into your all-inclusive, tolerant society?”
Quite a few of us here are ‘traditionally masculine men and feminine women’, including me, and no one here, including Ozy, has ever complained about it in the slightest. Do you really think that inclusive = excluding anyone ‘traditional’? Or are you just being deliberately obtuse?
On second thoughts, stupid question…
I find it funny whenever ppl say that ppl of all (or no) genders should be free to do what they want and be who they want to be w/o being put into little social boxes, ppl always assume therefore we think there’s something wrong w/ traditional roles xD I suppose supporting ppl’s right to be genderqueer, genderless and trans means we want to destroy all cis ppl too xD (oh wait, according to some, we are xD )
Srsly, like Laura, I’m a v feminine woman too xD (TOOO feminine for some XD ) so far I have not had Ozy telling me I am a bad person xD
Catching up xD Un momento por favor.
Honestly, at this point it sounds like you just keep replying for the sake of having the last word. Let it go already.
snrk xD let it go, so he can have the last word! xD Ion NEVER replies just for the sake of having the last word. xD And as usual, the “I’m not bothered by you! YOU ARE! xD”
of course the only way to prove that is to never laugh at him, counter him, disagree w/ him, notice that he got strangely angry etc etc xD convenient!
(I like how he acted I was an after thought, after y’know, quoting me first xD )
From now on nebody who replies to me is a Snabbit!
Or a rockoon o_o
xD
I like this strategy >:3
So has somebody responded w/ why feminism will destroy the world and when it’ll happen?
We can have like a feminism doomsday clock! 
*peers*
I killed the thread xD Oh well, since I did, and it got scrolled off b/c of crazy feminists destroyed the world pants, I will repost!
Ami-Activist Away!
I just got back from facilitating a forum on “Trans bodies, Trans selves” which is a new book project that is being worked on as we speak :] When completed, it’s going to be a resource guide for trans ppl, counselors, and families and allies, So far the topics it’s going to cover are:
Our May Selves
Gender Theory
Gender Around The World
Coming Out
Living As Ourselves
Healthcare
Relationships
Sexuality
Elderly And Aging
Children
Adolescents
Media
History
Law
Art
Action and Organizing
I want to promote the project b/c it’s a great idea and they need as much input as they get! Esp imo, for ppl who traditionally aren’t covered by the trans* umbrella, but who identify as trans, or who want to… cuz that’s the ppl the book also wants to include :3 And I think it’s V important to include! Also I’m putting it here (hopefully it’s ok w/ David) b/c I know there are many trans* ppl here and if ppl dunno about it, now you do and I think the more voices the better!
There are many things you can do to be involved if you want to be involved!
If you want to help organize an event (like the forum above, where ppl can actually attend and give their own experiences) or find out where one is taking place in your area, email naomi@transbodies.com (keep in mind there is abs no funding for this book or project)
Or visit
http://www.transbodies.com
to submit a short piece to Trans Bodies, Trans selves, about yourself, or nething you want to add to the project, challenges you feel from society as a trans person, things you would like them to discuss, stuff about law, or family, or medical issues, intersectionality, etc etc
Also take the survey! Thousands have filled it out… you should too!
And spread it around if you want to. I think the more ppl who participate, the better the guide will ultimately be, b/c the more diversity of experiences and ideas they’ll have to work from
I always show up to the rodeo late lately xD I’m failing at my job of being a rodeo cat! D:
Logic seems to do that to you.
Hrm… I guess I’ll try to fill out the sidebar w/ Amis xD
So… hrm… on Ozyism!
So, feminism and Ozyism is against feminine women and masculine men and are hoping to wipe them out? o_O I always find it weird, if ppl believe these things are so natural and normal, why do they get scared about loosening social pressures and restrictions on gender roles? o_O
It’s kinda like “if we don’t teach kids that homosexuality is wrong and unnatural, then they’ll all become gay!” xD
I was actually taught completely the opposite of female socialization (at least in terms of external overt pressure, the media and subtle stuff I still pick up like any other girl xD ) w/ completely the opposite social pressures pushing on me and I’m still like.. y’know.. me
Super femme! xD (to the point that ppl didn’t even believe I was reaaalllll xD when I was comics blogging) so presumably in Ozy’s world I’d be the same too, except it’d have happened earlier, I’d be happier, and I would have been saved a lot of abuse and pain 
( 
)
I fail to see the negatives :3
On the OP!
Since he’s a well travelled keen observer of stuff, I now want to take him on tours xD And have him observe other societies or countries or even regions in those countries :3 It could make a great book!
Or documentary xD
Oh man, Ion, just when I think you can’t get any funnier, you go and prove me wrong. Yep, you got me all right, me making fun of the dumbass stereotype of lefties and feminists as goofy hippie pacifists is totally the same as your “you wouldn’t say that shit to my face, you wouldn’t dare” routine.
And since when did you become an illogically anti-gun person? “Expression of repressed anger”? “Compensating for something”? That’s the same fact-devoid, emotionally driven empty reasoning I see coming from the people who seem to think every gun has evil installed in it in the factory before it gets boxed up. That’s the kind of shit that’s no better than the “tacticool” armchair warriors who think their fantasy solutions to situations like Breivik’s rampage are actually reasonable. But I know you’re not really taking that position, you’re just making another tedious attempt to make me blow up and lose it. You know, like you keep doing.
Also, love the “You’re posting at me! I’M WINNING!!!” thing. Because that obviously doesn’t apply to you at all and the only reason you keep slinging weak insults in my direction is because you’re driven by a higher calling.
So what happens when I stop acknowledging your existence entirely? I’m betting you still claim you’ve won, but I think I’m going to try it anyway. It’ll be fun watching you try and bait me into responding to anything. Cheers.
*scrolls back* Congratulations Kristin!!!
Well, if they aren’t then I’m not buying one. Of course judging by how mediocre I did at paintball, perhaps it’s best I dont buy one of those evil tools…
Well, now we can add “WWII” and “Global warming” to that list of “Things NWO is wrong about”.
Seriously, dude, do yourself a favour and do something other than be nasty to people online for an afternoon. It can’t be good for your health.
@Ami, I think the fact that apologists for traditional gender roles, like Ion, are so pissed off about non-traditional/non-binary genders/gender roles exposes the fact that they know how manufactured those traditional roles are. Just like you said - it’s the same thing as saying “If kids know that gay people exist, they’ll all be gay!” If it were so natural for men to be masculine and women to be feminine, then we wouldn’t have to work so hard or be shamed so much for not complying.
Turning a human being into a traditional man or a traditional woman takes a tremendous amount of effort from earliest childhood. I myself am comfortable with my gender assignment and presentation (pretty femme woman) and enjoy a lot of traditionally feminine activities, so of course I’m not going to call someone evil if they’re happy with their gender/gender role. But I do think it’s kind of a shame that we as a culture spend so much effort creating the gender box, since so many people suffer so greatly when they can’t fit into it. And I sort of wonder what kind of person I’d be if I hadn’t undergone intensive femininity training from day one.
Also props to Amused for saying that feminism isn’t about making women happy. It’s about making women free. Related, but not exactly the same thing.
@cynickal:
“Well, if they aren’t then I’m not buying one. Of course judging by how mediocre I did at paintball, perhaps it’s best I dont buy one of those evil tools…”
Some people have a natural aptitude for shooting that is truly astounding. They can make shots that seem impossible, show consistent accuracy with guns they’ve never even held before and generally just have a knack for it.
The other 99% of us on the planet have to invest a bunch of time and money learning how to shoot half as well as those other folks.
Other than that, basic safety and common sense are the most important things you need. Always treat the firearm as if it’s loaded even if you just unloaded it five seconds ago, never point it at anything you’re not willing to destroy, remember it’s not magic and life isn’t a movie. Me, I think I like working on them more than taking them out to shoot holes in paper, but both are enjoyable.
I know this wasn’t addressed at me, but wasn’t feminism a big part of communism, with all the leftist Marxist ideology?
*resists*
*resists*
*resists*
*gives in*
And traditional gender roles were a big part of Nazi Germany!
And traditional gender roles were a big part of Nazi Germany!
True, true. So why don’t we look at the economic situation and standard of living in Germany compared to Russia/ex-Soviet countries? Interesting.
I don’t think you’re understanding my point, sir. People should be free to do whatever they want, from MMA to knitting, without social opprobrium, as long as it does not harm themselves or others.
That… sounds fine, actually. So long as you also accept that people can frown on certain lifestyles which are sinful in the eyes of our Lord. (kidding, kidding
)
So what happens when I stop acknowledging your existence entirely? I’m betting you still claim you’ve won, but I think I’m going to try it anyway. It’ll be fun watching you try and bait me into responding to anything. Cheers.
Nah, I think I’ll just ignore you. Your impotent passive-aggressive anger has gotten boring and you haven’t said anything of value lately. Cheers.
ENACT YOUR PROPER STEREOTYPES OR I WILL TURN THIS CAR AROUND! -God
True, true. So why don’t we look at the economic situation and standard of living in Germany compared to Russia/ex-Soviet countries? Interesting.
I see someone has been taking Goebbels at face value. The standard of living in Nazi Germany was pretty bad for most of the population — and to be honest here, you have to concede that this “population” included the multitude of ethnic groups and religious minorities that were oppressed, enslaved, and/or isolated in concentration camps by the Nazi regime. To the extent that “real” Germans in Nazi Germany had nice things at all, those things were almost exclusively (1) plundered from occupied territories; or (2) produced using slave labor. If history is any guide, any economy that relies on military conquest and slave labor to keep itself afloat is a disaster in progress, and the standard of living of even its privileged citizens is volatile at best.
Besides, you still keep forgetting that even those genocidal policies aside, women comprise half the population. So why is it, when you characterize a standard of living as high or low, you take men’s standard of living as the only one that matters? Women’s standard of living is pretty low in any society that denies them basic civil rights. At this point, it’s really just a matter of values: if you have no problem with plunder, genocide, and slave labor ensuring your material comforts, then I guess you would also be perfectly okay with enforcing traditional gender roles in which the interests and comforts of only one half of humanity — yours — are deemed to have any significance.
Germany - Socialist/Democratic government with strong labor representation and feminist ideals as well as hundreds of years of industrialization.
Russia – Kleptocratic / Oligarchy government with some feminist ideals in urban areas but mostly patriarchal in the remainder of the country and barely half a century of industrialization.
We can add foreign policy, foreign governments and foreign business markets to “Things Ion Knows Nothing About.”
@Amused, he moved the goal posts on you.
He said to look at Germany/Russia-Ex Soviet countries.
He’s fast forward 75 years.
Regardless the idea that The Stalinist Soviet Union with barely 30 years between Tzarist agrarian society to Germany with a good 150 of industrial development is laughable in its ignorance. To conflate that with feminism is bemusing.
Just stand in awe of the vast gulf of ignorance Ion shows.
“Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I’m not sure about the former.” ~Albert Einstein
Not to mention that half of Germany belonged to/was run by the Soviet Union for decades and is hence technically a former part of the Soviet Union…
Thanks, cynical, I realize I gave him too much of a benefit of the doubt. So, what’s he saying, the high standard of living in Germany now is a consequence of Nazi policies?
Re. ex-Soviet countries, the trend does not support Ion’s contention that traditional gender roles are good for society. The more urbane and westernized those ex-Soviet countries are, and the more influenced by feminism — think the Baltics, Ukraine and Russia itself — the better their economy and standard of living is. By contrast, those ex-Soviet countries that adhere strictly to traditional gender roles — that is, countries located in Central Asia — are mired in poverty and civil war, and have a standard of living that’s borderline medieval.
Raoul, that made me LOL.
I was looking back through this and wanted to, belatedly, also offer my congratulations to Kristinmh and Skyal. Congratulations! I need to be a good faux-auntie and snatch up one of those “mammoth” onsies when they become available.
@Kristin, thank you very kindly. Plus congrats on forming babby.
<Nah, I think I’ll just ignore you. Your impotent passive-aggressive anger has gotten boring and you haven’t said anything of value lately. Cheers.
Shorter Ion: you can’t fire me! I quit!
” but wasn’t feminism a big part of communism, with all the leftist Marxist ideology? ”
No. Thank you for playing “Dumbass Questions with Obvious Answers.”
NWO: First off, Germany had literally won WW I before american involvement
If they had won… why is that the War was still going on, and hence able for America to get involved?
The Lusitania was sunk in 1915. The US entered the war in 1917.
The Treaty of Versailles was not what Wilson wanted. Moreover the great rate of inlation was because the US wouldn’t forgive it’s debts from England. Hardly a leftist sort of problem.
The US entry into WW2 was caused by leftists? That woult be Tojo, and Hitler, those notorious communists (After Japan attacked us, Hitler declared war on us).
Ion… wasn’t equality part of that whole American experiment with a new form of gov’t…”we hold these truths to be self-evident that all Men are created equal…?”
But, as you say, it is illustrative the things which come out of this sort of exchange.
Not only do you not actually look at the citations provided on the wiki page for original sourceing, but the wiki summary also proves you wrong.
Er, what? I genuinely have no idea what you mean or what you’re trying to prove.
What it seems to mean is you looked at the words, “wikipedia” and decided the tone of the summary in he online article meant the actual evidence (available from looking at the cited source material) was also weak.
In other words the same tendency to poor research you show in your work here, seems to apply when looking at other people’s work too.
Wikipedia is a poor thing to use as a primary source, because the collaborative nature of it makes the arguments in things which are edited by lots of people somewhat weak.* It does, however, make a very good starting point for looking at the shape of the subject; and with the time spent to follow the citations is a handy tool for starting primary research, much like any other encyclopedia.
*on topics of special/expert interest the articles in wikipedia can be quite good, the problem is one has to tolerably expert to know which those are.
mertvaya ruka: I’m in the 5 percent who are pretty good with about anything in the long gun category. Some of it seems to be native talent, a lot of it was hours on the line (when I was doing competition I was probably firing 100-150 rounds a day).
I can’t do the ridiculous things (like hit a half-dollar sized disk on the fly), but I can pretty much pick up any rifle and keep it to an MOA. I’ve done more than my share of tricky shots on the paintball field, or in force on force engagement while on field problems in the Army.
One of the things a pop-up range gives you is a much better ability to do reactive shooting. Make a mistake, and give me a couple of seconds to acquire, and I can reach out to about 300 yards, and hold that MOA. Snap shots at ranges out to about 75 are going to be a bit larger groupings… but 3 MOA at 50 meters is still going to get the job done.
I lived the Arab world for a quite a while and I don’t think this was written by an Arab man - sounds to me like an American’s fantasy of being Arab.