Manosphere civil war? MGTOWforums vs. A Voice for Men

Uh oh! Do I sense a manosphere civil war coming on? Over on MGTOWforums, some of the regulars are spitting mad at A Voice for Men. In a thread with the lovely title “So it begins: AVfM diluted by cuntspeak,” the MGTOWer calling himself fairi5fair takes aim at a recent post by – get this! – a woman on AVFM.

Not only that, but a woman who suggests that maybe MRAs spend too much time talking about female “hypergamy.” For the uninitiated, that’s a word that means “the practice of marrying into an equal or more prestigious social group or caste,” but that in the overheated imaginations of angry manosphere dudes has come to mean “all women are filthy lying golddigging whores who will ruthlessly exploit poor beta males and betray them by sleeping with any alpha male who wanders by, also by the way I hate women.”

Never mind that the woman in question writing on AVFM – Aimee McGee – is a thoroughly reactionary FeMRA sort who does indeed think that the manosphere version of hypergamy really is a thing, and who simply questions the strategic utility of bringing it up all the time. Evidently the MGTOWforums can’t stand even that teensy bit of criticism from someone with a vagina.

And so they let loose, at Ms. McGee and at AVFM for allowing her a platform. Linking to her AVFM piece, fairi5fair declares that it’s

a prime example of what happens when you let some women stick their fingers in your men’s rights pie. …

Fuck you, Aimee Mcgee. No, the MRM should absolutely educate young men about how hypergamy works and has worked for thousands of years so that they can protect themselves from exploitation….

So, Aimee McGee, you can go pound sand. The last thing we need is some dumb cunt backseat driving the MRM right into the mealy-mouthed gutter.

Others join in the attack. Bob is aghast that anyone would criticize his sacred right to badmouth women for being ruthless exploiters of hapless men.

The knowledge of hypergamy and it’s many implications is one of the most essential ingredients of the Red Pill. …

Without understanding hypergamy, you don’t understand why every fucking thing that 99.999% (conservatively) of women say and do is a lie.

To fail to teach a young man the dangers of hypergamy – and to condemn the women who fail to control their own hypergamy, as traditions used to do – is prepare young boys for butchery.

He follows these remarks with a quotation from Ayn Rand, evidently not seeing the GIGANTIC IRONY of doing that.

The Great One accuses Ms. McGee herself of hypergamy:

Yep, I skimmed the B.S. and it is just yet another female that is with a man being put through the court system by an ex. It amazing how quickly they change their tune when all the cash that their man could be spending on them suddenly disappears due to alimony and child support going to an ex. …

They can go from radical feminist to supporter of men’s rights at the drop of a hat when it suddenly suits their needs. These females will also go right the hell back to feminist when they think that feminism is going to get them what they want. …

Yet another thanks to the mods for keeping the estrogen away from this place. They just gotta stick their goofy giraffe heads in every fish bar.

No, I have no idea what that last sentence means either. [See below for an illustration of what this might look like.]

Speaking of complete incoherence, I Live for me not “WE” pops into the discussion to offer an angry little rant that contains this bit of wisdom:

Nature makes them grab a cotton plug every month but not all of them are deranged psychos when they do. Some are just bloated and irritable.. Some suddenly cry..Some are incredibly horny and I always found that disgusting but its NATURE.

Shade47 makes clear that he prefers his Men’s Rights movement women-free:

AVfM is an extreme disappointment.

They failed to observe history and let a woman enter their group. Now they are going to become history. Another statistic created by some miscellaneous attention whore. Chumps …

I will never support a MRA group that allows women to have a voice.

BusterMcFriendly suggests that FeMRAs are only in it for MRA badboy cock. No, seriously:

[T]he MRM are nothing but counter-cultural badboys. Don’t be fooled. Women in the MRM are just trying to hook an MRM superstar. I bet John the Other has marriage proposals on a weekly basis. Good God! Women are so stupid.

Obmon is outraged that any woman would dare try to speak for men:

The point of MGTOW is that they recognize the fact that ALL women LIE. They lie to get what they want. They lie to invade spaces meant for men. They lie to convince us that they are NAWALT. They lie to show us that they agree just so they can take over the argument. They lie so they can lie in the future. … Like a child doing something nice for mommy so he can tell her later that he broke her favorite vase.


Only a woman would try to minimize the truth about Hypergamy. Hypergamy is THE reason for the state of the justice system, relationships, etc. EVERYTHING a woman does will ultimately lead to hypergamy.

DruidV launches into a blistering  attack on AVFM and its star FeMRA, the blabby Canadian videoblogger who calls herself Girl Writes What:

I used to really enjoy that place [AVFM] but now it’s just like the NFL locker room. Cunts everywhere, stinking up the joint, blathering on like they understand anything other than their own miserable hypergamy. I knew right where AVFM was heading, the very first time I saw an article either ghost written or not, by GWW and friends asking (paraphrased): “What’s in the MRM for women?”

As if this question in and of itself wasn’t egregiously disgusting enough, her nebulously not surprising answer seemed to be “My boyfriend, my boyfriend, my boyfriend!!!!” which was then promptly golf-clapped into acceptance by the usual suspects. Christ, this bitch can’t get thru 2 sentences without having to remind us all that some mangina is properly kissing her glorious, grrrrl powered ass. Also, she seems to really want to be “the tits of the Men’s movement”, or some other such xx inspired tripe like that. …

These pathetic xxs like Asshole McGee, GWW and other xx “friends”, who are only just now jumping on the MRM bandwagon out of sheer desperation at seeing feminazism’s exposure and collapse and since they can easily see what lies ahead for themselves personally, are only interested in saving their own asses and being on the winning team. You can bet your ass these xxs would dump the MRM in a fucking heartbeat for feminazism, or anything else, that might possibly be able to do anything about the perfectly understandable backlash against xxs today. Makes me fucking sick to my core, and I already have a gut full of femallian treachery. …

Fuck you very much, Bitchface McGee, “Dr” Elam and all the rest of you grovelling AVFM idiots, who are still too fucking clueless to ever admit to yourselves or anyone else; AWALT! Take your fucking balls out of GWW’s purse and give these cunts the boot, FFS. That, or watch your male membership numbers dwindle to next to nothing as all teh menz head on over here, where ours is not now, nor ever to be co-opted by cunts. …

P.S. Maybe we can all pitch in and send AVFM some pink doilies, soaps and throw rugs for their clubhouse toilet.

There are several more pages of comments that follow, but, honestly, nothing quite tops that one.

EDITED TO ADD: Intrepid Man Boobz commenter Myoo has drawn us this excellent picture of what a giraffe sticking its goofy head in a fish bar might look like.

About David Futrelle

I run the blog We Hunted the Mammoth, which tracks (and mocks) online misogyny. My writing has appeared in a wide variety of places, including Salon,, the Washington Post, the New York Times Book Review and Money magazine. I like cats.

Posted on October 16, 2012, in $MONEY$, a voice for men, alpha asshole cock carousel, antifeminism, are these guys 12 years old?, bad boys, beta males, drama, evil women, FemRAs, girl germs, hate, incoherent rage, irony alert, johntheother, men who should not ever be with women ever, MGTOW, misogyny, MRA, no girls allowed, paul elam and tagged , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 243 Comments.

  1. Aw, what the heck. It’s been a while.

    The Book of Learnin’
    Indispensable Facts About the Universe from NWO
    Civil War Memorial Edition


    Evolution is impossible, because otherwise we’d be able to watch dogs evolve into super-dogs. Unless anyone can produce evidence of dogs with super-powers, evolution is a myth.

    The theory of evolution claims that life came from rocks. It also states that evolution doesn’t occur anymore because rocks are no longer in make-life mode.

    In the animal kingdom, females entice males with their spectacular plumage and mating displays. Female animals in heat wear miniskirts and high heels.

    Female animals cannot feed themselves and rely on males to support them. Even in cases where this seems untrue, the males are still tougher. For example, female lions do all the hunting in the pride, but if they come across a really tough enemy, like a hyena, they run and get the male lion to fight for them.


    Feminists claim that one in four women is raped in college. But since college lasts for four years, you have to multiply that by four. Therefore, feminists are really saying that 100% of women are raped in college, which is obviously untrue, not to mention proof that women are bad at math.

    There are two kinds of numbers, quantative and qualative.

    70% of 100 is 200.

    Health and Medicine

    Diseases, obesity, starvation, malnutrition and ADHD are all caused by the international food and drug standards passed in 2010.

    Children are lined up and injected with a dangerous chemical called flouride to make them stupid.

    Mammograms cause breast cancer. Doctors advise women to get mammograms at least once a week until they develop cancer from it.

    Many hospitals are open only to women and children. They’re not maternity/pediatric hospitals, just regular hospitals that refuse to treat men for no reason.

    Male suicide is caused by society trying to feminize men, which makes them so depressed they kill themselves. Before modern feminism, suicide was practically non-existent.

    After an abortion, the fetus is chopped into pieces and thrown into the nearest river or lake to feed the fish.

    If the FDA worked, we’d have cures for cancer, diabetes, and every disease and ailment. Since we don’t, it’s not doing anything useful and should be abolished.

    All drugs and medication are unsafe except marijuana.

    Male erections are incredibly painful.


    Reading is not taught in American public schools.

    Public schools offer two kinds of math: traditional arithmetic and New Math. Children are allowed to choose which one to learn.

    There are twice as many teachers and half as many students in U.S. schools as there were 20 years ago. These teachers spend class time walking around in their underwear to arouse elementary-school boys.

    There are special schools for toddlers where they are taught about sodomy.

    NASA has a program for girls that allows them to automatically become astronauts just by signing up.

    How-to courses on homosexuality are taught in public schools. This is how people become gay.

    In order to attend any college in the U.S., male students are required to watch a video about how men are evil and women are good. The student must then take a test about the video, and if he scores less than 100% he can’t go to college.

    Colleges require male students to dress in women’s clothing and march around campus so the female students can harass them. If they don’t do this, they are punished.


    Ancient Greece, Rome, Persia, and China under the Ming Dynasty were extremely progressive, feminist societies. That’s why they collapsed.

    In societies where girls were sold into marriage to older men, it was just as common for boys to be sold into marriage to older women.

    In ancient Greece, it was considered acceptable for women to molest little girls.

    In ancient China, elite women castrated young boys, while giggling, to turn them into their playtoys. These women lived in harems but were actually in charge.

    Before modern feminism, rape was a rare occurrence and almost unheard-of.

    The Americas were discovered by Queen Isabella, who ordered every man in Europe to sail westward to get exotic jewels, perfumes and silks for her. It was a stroke of luck that Columbus found land before the male population of Europe perished in a watery grave.

    The Declaration of Independence declared America’s independence from international bankers. It was repealed by Woodrow Wilson.

    The only problem faced by female African-American slaves was that no one helped them into carriages. Therefore, a white man who has to stand on a bus has suffered worse than Sojourner Truth.

    Lynchings in the American South consisted of women accusing men of rape because they were man-hating feminists. In cases where a man was lynched on an accusation from another man, the lynchings were justified.

    The Russian Revolution was organized by the international Jewish banking conspiracy to destroy Russia.

    Women sank the Lusitania as part of a feminist plot to get the U.S. involved in WWI so that men could die needlessly, because women just enjoy watching men die.

    The Cambodian genocide: planned and executed entirely by women.

    The CIA imported feminism from the Soviet Union by publishing Ms. magazine and Miss Mag and channeling funds to a woman named Gloria Steinen.

    No woman has ever been enslaved or exploited.


    The rivers of most major cities are lined with foul-smelling, dangerous factories. These factories are staffed entirely by overworked, underpaid male laborers, but they also have well-appointed human resources departments staffed by women in fancy clothes, fine jewelry and perfume. Since all the men work as laborers and all the women work as posh secretaries, researchers are still unsure who owns or runs these factories.


    Spanish and Russian use the same alphabet. The Russians just have a funny kind of handwriting called cryillic script.

    The word “dudebro” is hate speech.

    Arts and Entertainment

    The Iliad is the story of how Queen Helen of Troy ordered two armies to fight over her. It is based on a true story.

    The classical Greek play The Bacchae is a celebration of the roving lesbian gang that murdered the musician Orpheus. It is based on a true story.

    The musical Chicago is a polemic about how men should be shot to death. It was written by a female college student in 2010.

    All prime-time TV shows are about a pretty girl being stalked and assaulted by an evil man. She is saved by an all-female investigative team, with a single man in charge. At the end of every episode, the victim sits in a one-way mirrored room, watching the chained-up man with a smug look on her face. Then one of the women from the investigative team squeezes her arm.

    Shows on the Disney Channel consist of underage girls in sexy outfits hitting boys while the boys cower before them.

    Someday NWO will create a video game in which shapeless grey blobs fight straight white Christian male terrorists by throwing marshmallows at them and turning into rainbow lions that spew butterflies from their mouths until the terrorists disappear in a mist of flowers and unicorns. It will be a massive hit.


    Most girls and women over the age of twelve wear see-through tops and micro-miniskirts on all occasions. Although their skirts are so short their genitals hang out, they do not wear underwear.

    The only exceptions to this rule are shopping malls, where girls and women typically wear bikinis.

    Women become sexually aroused by wearing clothes. This is the full extent of female sexuality.


    All U.S. law, from the Constitution down, has been supplanted by Title IX, a law requiring that all educational, government, and private institutions be 100% female. Title IX has its own police force, which is exactly like the Nazi SS. This takeover of the government was orchestrated by Russlynn Ali, Assistant Secretary for Civil Rights in the Department of Education, who now rules the country.

    The Violence Against Women Act will create a slush fund which will be used to fund the training of all American men to defer to women by Pavlovian response.

    The United States is a communist dictatorship ruled by an emperor. If it were a free country, people wouldn’t have to pay taxes or get licenses to drive.

    Requiring people to take a vision test to get a driver’s license is an atrocity on the level of the Holocaust, Pol Pot’s genocide, and the famous Communist massacre of Christians.

    Each law has its own police force and legal system. For example, if you urinate in public, the Urination Police will arrest you.

    The Southern Poverty Law Center is classified as a hate group. It is a Communist organization, possibly the best-funded in the country, and its ultimate goal is to destroy Christianity and the family.

    Women are classified as a hate group. Yes, all women.

    However, the largest hate group in the U.S. is the government. The second largest is the media, for supporting the government.


    False reporting of rape is the most serious and common crime in the U.S. The most common reasons for a woman to make up a rape accusation are cheating, revenge, excuse for missed homework, lateness, work absence, and getting out of paying cab fare.

    The average man is falsely accused of rape and thrown into prison without trial on a daily basis. Available statistics say otherwise because the true numbers are kept under wraps by the CIA.

    Gay people are fifteen times more likely than straight people to be violent criminals. All the worst serial killers in history were gay.

    California has replaced its women’s prisons with spas to reward women for committing crimes.

    If there is yelling in a house, the police are legally required to arrest any men inside.


    Oprah and the founder of BET are both rich, therefore African-Americans are financially the most privileged group in the U.S.

    Women are not required to pay rent.

    There are no poor women. Whenever a woman needs anything, she sits in the middle of the street and cries, and passerby throw food and money at her for free.

    Women control 80% of the world’s wealth, thanks to all the crying.

    Marxism does not belong in this section, because it has nothing to do with economic theory. It’s actually a philosophy promoting diversity, feminism, and gay rights in order to destroy Western civilization.

    Business and Employment

    Hiring female employees doubles the cost of the goods a company produces.

    Women go to plumbing school to get jobs as construction flaggers so they can wear hotpants and work on their tans. Also, plumbing schools for women are way more fun than plumbing schools for men.

    Despite all the women attending plumbing schools, only men work in sanitation. Sewage is processed by men wallowing in it until it gets clean.

    Men can’t be allowed to work at Hooters because that would turn it into Gay Hooters and no one would go.

    It’s very rare for a man in the U.S. to be employed above a middle-management position. All high-paying jobs are held by women.

    Charitable Giving

    For every dollar women donate to charities to help men, men donate ten billion dollars to help women.

    Women’s groups typically receive hundreds of billions of dollars a year in funding. One of the groups that receives the most money is the National Association of Women Lawyers.

    Nonprofit organizations operate by photocopying fliers, posting them on walls around town, then sitting back and waiting for the money to roll in. Even though the average nonprofit doesn’t do anything else, it’s much too hard for a man to start one, because men are oppressed.

    Men are not allowed into homeless shelters unless they swear allegiance to feminism.

    Throughout history, billions of men have died for the sake of women, whereas no woman has ever died for the sake of a man. The best way to balance this injustice is for women to randomly punch each other in the nose.


    All nations are controlled by the U.N. and the Jews.

    Except for Rupert Murdoch, all financial, government and media leaders worldwide are either black or Arab. There are no white men in top positions of power.

    Vice-President Joe Biden, like nearly all U.S. leaders, is of Middle Eastern descent.

    Without government, homosexuality would not exist.

    Foreign Relations

    Wars are typically started by women nagging their husbands to invade other countries to get pretty dresses.

    Female protesters, no matter what the subject of the protest, are just there to goad men into killing each other. They are never injured or killed themselves.

    Russia is the deathplace capital of the world for men because feminism was invented there (see Feminism). It is the most feminist country on earth.

    All taxes in Scandinavian countries go toward women’s causes. Scandinavian grade schools have a holiday where girls are given cookies and ice cream, while boys are given stale matzo. Men in Scandinavian countries are imprisoned for farting.

    Pet Ownership

    Only women own cats. The main reason women own cats is so they can spend money on kitty litter that would otherwise go to men’s shelters.


    Women hit men to test them as romantic partners. If a man hits back, it’s proof that he’s a worthy mate with strong genes, and the woman will immediately have sex with him.

    Men enjoy being raped. Any man who says otherwise is lying.

    When gay men have sex, they usually do it in front of a straight woman to provide her with free entertainment. Straight women are working to turn more men gay so they can enjoy plenty of gay sex shows.

    Women are not physically attracted to men. This is why men don’t Bejazzle their testicles.

    Marriage and Family

    99% of feminist marriages end in divorce.

    The vast majority of violent rapists come from female-led households, because the feminist indoctrination boys receive in such households makes them so angry they have to go out and rape people to let off steam.

    Fatherhood is illegal in Britain and there are plans to outlaw it in the U.S.

    The most common reason women give for divorce is boredom.

    Gender and Sexuality

    Transgender people who have transitioned describe themselves as “transed.” Transed people frequently and repeatedly change not just their gender, but their species. Dogs can also be transed, making them suitable partners for transed people.

    Youth Culture

    Teenage girls participate in hazing rituals wherein they go to the mall in sexy outfits, usually bikinis (see Fashion). If a man looks at them for more than six seconds, they pounce on him en masse and strip him naked.

    At the age of five, children are tossed out of the house by their parents. At that point they are able to support themselves and require no further care.

    At the age of five, most children are still in diapers.


    Judaism is the most aggressively evangelical religion on earth. Less than 5% of Jews are ethnically Jewish, while the rest are recruited from the tireless Jewish recruitment efforts.

    In the story of Jesus saving the adulteress from stoning, the moral is that sinners deserve to be stoned.


    All child molesters are either women or gay men, and they only target boys. Girls are never molested.

    Prepubescent girls desperately want to have sex with middle-aged men. They advertise this desire by wearing swimsuits to the beach.


    Feminism is a highly organized international movement created in the Soviet Union and currently funded by the United Nations.

    Feminism is the cause of all black suffering.

    Phyllis Schlafly has worked tirelessly throughout her life to promote feminist causes.

    Predictions of the Future

    By the end of 2012, federal law will require that 50% of all CEOs be women. Male CEOs will be fired en masse, and random unqualified women will be hired to fill their seats.

    Someday a straight white man will beat up a lesbian for molesting a five-year-old. Everyone in the world will sympathize with the lesbian and immediately legalize child molestation.

    The U.S. will soon embrace the pedophilia of the ancient Greeks as the New Truth.

    Grade schools will soon require children to pledge allegiance to the idea that women are morally superior to men. This future event has punctured the space-time continuum and is causing girls and women to feel superior right now.

  2. I wasn’t feeling so great just now, but the sheer absurdity of the fish bar (and the adorable kitty videos) have managed to get me to crack a smile.

  3. <blockquote<When I encounter one, my palms itch, my skin crawls and my gums bleed spontaneously.

    DarrylX, I’m pretty sure what you need is a dermatologist and a dentist for these problems.

    NWO, you aren’t even trying anymore. It’s so sad to see a former great fall so hard.

    TTF: the FeMRAs don’t think the MRAs are including them in their hate speech–they’re too special.

  4. Fuckin’ blockquotes.

  5. aaaand the book of learnin’ sent me over the edge into laughter

    you guuuuys🙂

  6. Myoo, huzzah, that drawing is wonderful!

    Here’s a bengal cat making funny gobbling noises — near the end of the video:


    OK massive derail here but I’ve just seen this status post from someone I barely know on facebook:

    “‎15 swedish people have been arrested in Berlin this evening after a sexual assault on the German football team. Reports say that the assault occured around 8:45 and lasted 90 minutes with a 15 minute break in between 2 45 min sessions. It is believed that the assault was masterminded by Ibrahimovic and carried out willingly by the 14 Swedish players. It is also believed that Elm, Lustig, Elmander were the most instrumental in the assault. More on this story to come.”

    I’m not being paranoid but this is really, really not cool right?

    But like help, what do I do? I’m really struggling to just let this go but I don’t think I’ve even ever met the guy…

    But… just…. god.

  8. The Kittehs' Unpaid Help

    Kitty laughs at Owly

  9. @aworldanonymous
    If you want that picture in a smaller size and you’re not sure how to do it I can post a smaller version if you’d like, just tell me what size you need.

  10. Sounds like the cold case cops should have a talk with Darryl X. Just saying.

  11. The Kittehs' Unpaid Help

    Historophilia – was it meant to be some sort of horrible joke message? I can’t find any news items about it. It reads like a gross comparison of a match with rape. Is that what you meant?

  12. The Book of Larnin’, while hilarious, depresses me because NWO promised to go through it point by point after he won Troll of the Year, and he never even got to the super dogs.

  13. Historophilia, no that is not cool.

    I have a big group of FB friends who’d mostly be upset by that, so I’d feel comfortable saying something like “Did you really just compare a football game to rape? Gross.” or something similar. On the other hand, I have a handful of FB friends who are rabid right-wingers, and if they posted something like that about politics, I’d just hide them so I didn’t see stuff that upset me. You have to pick your battles, you know?

  14. @Historophilia
    You’re not being paranoid, that is not cool at all. I’m not sure what to do about it though, maybe just tell him that crap is really offensive, possibly link him to this post about why rape jokes aren’t funny or this post that mentions some of the key points of the previous one if you think the first one’s too long.

  15. Have you googled to see how rad fems and contemporary feminists fight every day? How FtB often have fight with transphobic rad fems?

    You’ve been reading and watching too many of the other kinds of David — Broder, Brooks, and Gregory. Now you’ve got it into your head that journalism is the mere cataloguing of how both sides are equally wrong, and you think if this David here points out something stupid or egregious that happened on the MRAs, he ought to find something that can be spun into being equally stupid or egregious that Amanda Marcotte said.

    Well have I got news for you, spunky. Not only is this here a personal blog, and not a newspaper, not only is what David puts here specifically not journalism and just because he’s a journalist off the Net, that doesn’t make everything he types ever always journalism, but also JOURNALISM DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY.


  16. You’ve got to love the efforts schticky puts into typing up his utterly brainless little critiques of David’s “journalism,” too. You’d think after being being told he’s annoying and will be banned if he posts too much, he’d just take a level in asshat like the other trolls and talk about how we’re all hateful Nazi baby-killers or whatever it is the other trolls are on about.

    But instead he keeps right at it, as though David actually cares and values his contributions. He’s sort of like a male Ruby, in that sense.

  17. The Kittehs' Unpaid Help

    At least Ruby isn’t prolix, I’ll give her that much.

  18. …giraffes?

    Sorry, I just stuck on that. *headtilt*

  19. thebewilderness

    The first time I ran into this ‘I am your self appointed editor and you must engage in conversation with me about your many faults’ routine was around about 2005 at Echidne’s blog. Some person who shall go nameless had a virtual meltdown over Echidne’s failure to immediately respond to the persons comments. The commenter continued to slurp from the delicious chum bucket of outrage throughout the weekend, in spite of people repeatedly explaining that the blog owner took week ends off.
    Schticky d00d reminds me of that particular style of trolling every time he posts.

  20. Here’s something for those dictionary-definition trolls:

    Prime Minister Julia Gillard’s speech in Parliament on misogyny has prompted the Macquarie Dictionary to broaden its definition of the word.

  21. @Myoo

    I’m not sure exactly what size I’d need, I think I’ll just use it as my desktop background,

    @Kitteh’s Unpaid Help

    I’m sorry but that video is horrifying.

  22. Here’s an un-horrifying video:

  23. Sir Bodsworth Rugglesby III

    Is that really necessary? I’d have thought the dictionary definition would already have mentioned Tony Abbott by name.

  24. *watches cloudiah’s video, is smothered in adorbs*

  25. The definition could just be a pic of TA’s smirk

  26. I thought, until I read the replies, that the Swedish team actually assaulted the German team. I had a sad, but the fact that it’s a comparison to a fucking sport makes me angrier.

    I, for one, have a zero tolerance policy concerning rape jokes on my Facebook.

  27. The Kittehs' Unpaid Help

    Aworldanonymous – yeah, it’s kind of grotesque, like a glorified gif rather than a video. It seemed all the more appropriate for a response to Owly for that reason.:/


    Sir Bodsworth and Magpie – ROFL too true!

  28. @cloudiah


    @The Kittehs’ Unpaid Help

    Owly scares me enough on his own, though the response is more amusing in that light.

  29. The Kittehs' Unpaid Help

    Yeah, I alternate between laughing at Owly’s stupidity and being appalled at his rapist rhetoric. If the Great Feminazi Conspiracy he so fervently believes in really existed, he’d be doing life without parole by now, as would most of the MRM.

  30. There is absolutely nothing wrong with bringing woman voices on board. They should in no sense be a majority; however and critically, female voices are crucial in the Movement and should be accepted, not shunned. And realistically, they certainly aren’t dominant. Get back to me when Ms. What becomes editor-in-chief of AVFM, and we’ll talk.

    …After all, we wouldn’t want to be like the feminists, who showed their true colors in regards to the Hugo Schwyzer hate campaign.

  31. Excuse me? Yes, Steele, people hate poor Hugo for no good reason at all. Yeah, right.

    Your first graph is a hot mess. Your writing hasn’t improved a whit, even with your incessant bloviating.

  32. Hellkell, Schwyzer is an avatar; an example of the treatment men can expect should they become involved with feminism. I believe I can assure you that, even if they aren’t making it known, many men are getting the message loud and clear.

    The Movement can avoid that, and AVFM has done an excellent job creating a strong pro-ally space.

  33. @Magpie
    “Prime Minister Julia Gillard’s speech in Parliament on misogyny has prompted the Macquarie Dictionary to broaden its definition of the word.”

    And now the new and improved meaning.

    “But the dictionary’s editor, Sue Butler, says the definition will now be broadened to include “entrenched prejudice against women”.

    The best part is, merely disagreeing with the new and improved version indicates an entrenched prejudice against women. That is saweeeeeeeet!

    Lets see.
    We’ve expanded the definition of rape to encompass anything a woman wants it to be.
    We’ve expanded the definition of sexual harassment to encompass anything a woman wants it to be.
    We’ve expanded the definition of misogyny to encompass anything a woman wants it to be.

    If you disagree you’re a rape apologist, a predator, a misogynist or all of the above.

    What is feminism you ask? Hmmmmm. It could best be described as a conservative movement of state enforced chivalry to infantilize women. An infant can never be contradicted or blamed for anything. They don’t need to achieve anything. No one expects an infant to have morals. No one expects reason or logic or anything at all from infants. They need to be protected and provided for. They’re infants.

  34. HAHAHA, OK, Steele. Tell me the minute that GWW or one of the others writes something PaulE and the gang don’t like, they won’t kick her out of the club. She won’t even have to almost kill someone like Hugo did for it to happen.

    You’re overlooking the fact that Hugo set himself up (with the help of some feminists I don’t respect at all) as Boss Feminst, and I’m sorry, men don’t get that job.

    If you really think that AVfM has created a pro-ally space, you a even more delusional than you normally are.

  35. Sir Bodsworth Rugglesby III

    It still cracks me up when Steelepole capitalises the word ‘movement’.

  36. Colour me unsurprised that Steele “Your child-rape apologia disgusts me Tom Martin… holla at ur boi” Varpole can’t understand why people might not want attempted murderers in their movement.

  37. captainbathrobe

    The Movement can avoid it, but they most assuredly won’t, since virtually everyone in the Movement hates women. Sad but true.

  38. If anyone cares, a “fish bar” is a Britishism for a fish and chips shop.

    I had to look it up because I was reading “Felicia’s Journey,” and they go to a fish bar in that book.

  39. Hugo is an example of how anyone who admits to trying to murder their partner within a self-absorbed solipsistic redemption narrative will not be respected by feminists, yes. I don’t see how that’s a bad thing.

  40. Hellkell, Schwyzer is an avatar; an example of the treatment men can expect should they become involved with feminism. I believe I can assure you that, even if they aren’t making it known, many men are getting the message loud and clear.

    That’s weird, because I’m a man and the message I’m getting is “As long as you truly care about sexism you’re welcome here, no matter what your sexual orientation, gender presentation, ethnicity, looks, financial situation, etc.”

    I must have some wires crossed or something.

  41. Besides, everyone knows the Movement’s dead

  42. Sir Bodsworth Rugglesby III

    Sure, there was the whole “attempted murder” thing, but on the other hand feminists don’t like him. Since feminists always get things wrong, they clearly should like him.

    But then again, if feminists did like him, they’d still be wrong (because feminists), and he’d also be the kind of mangina that feminists like, so he’d be wrong also…

    Wait, maybe feminists should neither like or dislike him, but let him keep talking on their behalf? I guess?

    But then again, it’s not really about him, is it? It’s about how feminists treat men in their movement – always getting irrationally angry at them over the least little hint of self-confessed attempted murder… No that doesn’t sound right either.

    Steele? Little help here?

  43. Being prejudiced against people who attempt murder is misandry, because…wait. Steele, what exactly are you trying to say about men as a group there? Because it sounds like you’re implying something that would have made even Mary Daly say “wait, that’s a bit much”.

  44. @Shadow

    How did they get on the ceiling?

  45. NWO’s posts just sound like a toddler throwing a hissy fit. We’re not a babysitters, man, and I’m looking at you too, bored stick.

    NWO, we can only correct you so many times, dude — like your mention of “enforced chilvary.” If you don’t know by now that chilvary isn’t a feminist invention, with all those books and such out there just waiting to be read, I’m going to just assume you’re broadcasting from dimension X….or you’re just another troll doing the willful ignorance bit.

  46. Says, don’t give me that. Schwyzer’s transgressions were nothing more than an excuse for the feminists to plausibly tear down a male ally. I say again – were Ms. What or any other woman MRA to reveal such transgressions, there would be a furor to be sure, but in no sense would there be immediate exile followed by mobthink and harassment.

  47. Awwww! Owly followed my link …. good on you, NWO. 😉

  48. So, to be clear, you think that feminists as a group don’t actually care that Hugo tried to kill his ex-girlfriend? You can’t see how a group of mostly women might find the idea that a man attempted to murder his intimate partner a little alarming, and thus decide that now that they know that they really don’t want to be around him?

    Wow, you’re stupid.

  49. Did anyone else understand steele’s last post? The second sentence is, uh, kinda messy.

  50. I think he just openly admitted that his movement has nothing against people who attempt murder, and would never exclude members for admitting that they’d done so. For some reason he thinks this is a good thing.

  51. Oh right, Steele, if GWW revealed she had engaged in predatory sexual behavior against young men she had power over, and had attempted to murder her boyfriend, MRAs would embrace her unequivocally.

  52. So, to be clear, you think that feminists as a group don’t actually care that Hugo tried to kill his ex-girlfriend?

    I think the feminists cared insofar as it was a means to an end – that being Schwyzer’s exile under a halfway palatable justification. I think this had long been brewing in “the back room”, as it were, and the feminists jumped at the chance when they saw it, dangling like a tasty piece of steak. If it wasn’t this, it would have been something else. He needed to go.

  53. I mean, I don’t think very highly of the MRM, and even so I think that if GWW were to say “oh, yeah, and also I tried to kill my ex, and the point of that is how redemptive the whole experience ended up being for me” then she’d lose a big chunk of her supporters.

  54. Steelepole, why did feminists go after Schwyzer but we let David hang around? What was so threatening about Schwyzer? I thought feminists loved our manginas and white knights, per the MRM.

  55. Yeah, OK.
    It’s puzzling, Cassandra, because he seems to be implying that he’s taking the higher ground.


  56. They’d excommunicate GWW if she so much as took child support or alimony, so shut the fuck up, Steele.

  57. HAHAHA Steelepolebuttears, mobthink and harassment is what MRAs do. Have you not been paying attention, or.

  58. I think the feminists cared insofar as it was a means to an end – that being Schwyzer’s exile under a halfway palatable justification. I think this had long been brewing in “the back room”, as it were, and the feminists jumped at the chance when they saw it, dangling like a tasty piece of steak. If it wasn’t this, it would have been something else. He needed to go.

    Damn those feminists, plotting against other feminists in their smoke-filled back rooms! What was the source of their unfair hatred of Hugo Schwyzer? Why did he have to go?

  59. Steele, he did need to go, but not for the simple reasons you think.

  60. Sir Bodsworth Rugglesby III

    @ Shiraz – if I’m following correctly, through all the unnecessary clauses he’s saying that if a woman MRA admitted to attempting to murder a former husband or boyfriend, then the MRA would gently upbraid her for her naughtiness, but basically be okay with her continuing to speak on their behalf.

    To which, what can one say but Ahahaha! Hahahaha! Hahahahaha!

  61. Remember that time this one random blogger said she was uncomfortable with a man being around toddlers in the bathroom or whatever? Mobthink and harassment Exhibit A.

  62. “…as it were.”

    Again with the faux-Morpheus bullshit.

  63. So what you’re saying is that your moral compass is broken and you have no sense of self-preservation, and for some odd reason you assume these to be universal problems rather than specific to you.

    (For any lurkers reading along, a tip – if someone discloses to you that they have in the past attempted to murder people, especially people very much like you, and they don’t appear to understand why this was a bad thing to do not because it upset them but because they nearly killed someone, get away from that person ASAP. This has been today’s dose of basic self-preservation.)

  64. Sir Bodsworth Rugglesby III

    “…as it were.”

    Again with the faux-Morpheus bullshit

    It’s the repeated attachment of the phrase “in no sense” to clauses which have only reasonable interpretation that makes me LOL.

  65. Steele’s right, though, The Movement has made a pretty solid ally space—for women like GWW, who cheerfully quote long sections of articles arguing that women are herd animals, or TyphonBlue and her “pleasing men’s penises elevates women above livestock” article, or Nurdy Dancing and her “Misogynist is the new [N-Word]” article. Indeed, The Movement has created such a strong ally space that if men were to say things as “misandric” as misogynistic as those women’s word are, The Movement would be cheerfully deriding such male feminists as scum-sucking, pussy-begging manginas. Of course, they call pretty much every male feminist exactly that, so that’s not saying much.

  66. Cthulhu's Intern

    “Are you two having an ugly contest? I’ll make it easy for you: You both win!” – Serious Sam

  67. They should in no sense be a majority; however and critically, female voices are crucial in the Movement and should be accepted, not shunned.

    majority; however and critically, female voices

    however and critically

    Steele, I’m only saying this because I want to like you — you need to stop trying to write. Just say what you need to say and be done with it. I know writing long compound-complex sentences is fun, but you end up with something like “however and critically” and anyone who speaks (or reads) decent English cringes in terror.

    Stop trying for complexity, and start trying for clarity.

    Schwyzer’s transgressions were nothing more than…

    …attempted murder.

    I think the feminists cared insofar as it was a means to an end…

    In spite of your posts here, I have a hard time believing you actually think that entire groups of women don’t give a shit about domestic violence and attempted murder unless it can be used as a means to an end. Think about it for a minute, Steele. Stifle whatever contrarian impulse drives you and think about it.

    I say again – were Ms. What or any other woman MRA to reveal such transgressions, there would be a furor to be sure, but in no sense would there be immediate exile followed by mobthink and harassment.

    Remember, this is coming from a post where part of “the Movement” is speaking out because they don’t want “some dumb cunt backseat driving the MRM right into the mealy-mouthed gutter.”

    Context is misandry — was that NWO?

  68. I’m going to write a book. It will be about some woman in her thirties of fading beauty who meets some shy but modestly successful man who immediately falls madly in love with her despite her flaws because he is just so not shallow and such a nice guy if you get to know him. In repayment for his kindness, the woman in her thirties cheats on said nice guy, repeatedly and often, with loud and abrasive dudes with relatively more social status than the nice guy. While the nice guy can prove nothing, he knows this is happening because he is a logician extraordinaire. Anyway, after a time the woman in her thirties grows weary of the nice guy and decides to divorce him. She exchanges knowing glances with her judge and says ‘he “abused” me’. The judge chortles down the sleeve of his robe and immediately grants the woman in her thirties the nice guy’s entire salary for all time plus ten percent in case he finds a second job. The woman in her thirties both steals the nice guys children and travels back in time to abort them without the nice guy’s consent. Since the nice guy makes oh so much money, the woman in her thirties is able to support several abrasive tatooed dudes living in the nice guy’s house while financing a Feminist organization working (successfully) towards the chemical castration of all men who don’t use proper honorifics when addressing women. I am drunk.

  69. Wait, there isn’t already someone selling that book on

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